Those Champions League Final Penalty Kicks

Hey Sheps, what about the one before that, when he won the champions league on penalty kicks, idiot! Sheva would have scored in regular time if they played him. Who would you rather have playing in a final? Terry or Sheva?.... Easiet decision, thats why Grant is such a bad coach. Leaving sheva on the bench will forever haunt him.

Although I argue against every suggested rule change (apart from the possible addition of two more - live - linesmen to accommodate for modern pace), I still think a penalty kick is a terrible way to lose a hard fought game. "Playing on," as in some other sports, is a cruel concept in this one, and might have caused some real injury on last night's sliding pitch, so I'm short of suggestions, still...

Otherwise, teams matched up over course of game, the intensity was great. Some great play, some dirty, some just off, if penalties had to be, great for Giggs' to win. And no excuse whatsoever for the pitch to actually uproot and move about -- those who weren't cramped were concussed!

Shaz - I agree with alot of what your saying, Chelsea didn't get into United's box, and they did only have a measely 3 shots on target. But they did hit both the crossbar (lampard) and post (drogba) which I would consider really good chances by anyone standards - both times Van der Saar was beaten.

As for Carvalho's challenge, I'd somewhat controversally argue he won the ball first so had every right to be in there. He did get alot of Ronaldo afterwards, but at the end of the day where is he going to go after he's got the ball? If your gonna have slide tackles thats always going to happen. He can't really get out of the way. I'd argue its a free kick, but I don't think he should be sent off by any stretch of the imagination - its actually really similar to Scholes tackle in the Juventus '99 game, and there was uproar that he was booked for that at the time.

I'd argue Man United did have very good chances - Giggs should have won it but for JT's miraculous header, Carrick's shot was rubbish, and right at Cech, and Tevez header was a half decent chance. The one where he slid across the line I'm not convinced about because I think even he thought Makelele was getting there and reacted late.

I've got no argument regarding the pen takers. I'd have hated Giggs to miss, if anyone deserved a winning penalty it was obviously him. The way he represents United is only the same as Terry does for Chelski though.

Yes $killZ, because he did so well in his last Champions League final penalty shoot out....

Rob - I agree with that. United should have won it in the first half, but then Chelsea should have won it in the second.

Rob, when did Chelsea get into the box? Because it's all nice and dandy to take 24 shots from outside the box, but the chance of beating VDS is going to be low. Man U perhaps "only" had 15 shots, but not only were they more on-target, but they were often from closer, and involved a specific set-up. I didn't see Chelsea doing many crosses, nor many one-twos, nor really anything to try to get past Man U's defence. So they shot from 30 yards. And it almost succeded (Lampard's goal comes after Essiens' 40-meter shot is deflected twice, Drogba's shot that hit the bar), but it didn't reflect the fact that they created abysmally little. Can you tell us how many times Cole, Malouda or Drogba got through clean on goal? How many times they combined to create reasonable scoring opportunities? How many times they "got past" Man U's defence? I didn't count, but I'd be interested. And then, if you could just count the same things for Ronaldo and Evra. I don't think you'll need to count Tevez and Rooney's one-two on the edge of the box that was a little two strong. I don't think you'll need to go looking at how many times Man U got past Cashley (Brown, Hargreaves, Scholes all did it). Just Evra-Ronaldo. And they created more than Chelsea did.

Yes, Chelsea had more ball posession in the second half. But they didn't do anything with it. Yes, Ronaldo wasn't as good in the second half, but perhaps Carvalho's "Taylor"-esque tacle has something to do with it (it's crazy, when you look at the replay, you realise he is not only much later than Taylor on Eduardo, but also higher on the shin, and that 9 months of vacation were only avoided because Ronaldo was nimble enough to jump before he was hacked to the ground). But Man U still had just as many good chances. Chelsea fans bemoan the two times they were denied by the woodwork, Man U fans were complaining they were unlucky when Tevez missed (twice) from very close, and Carrick and Giggs missed what should have been easy goals.

Oh, and two remarks : During the brawl, Ricky Carvalho grabbed Nani by the neck... And didn't get sent off. Chelsea should have finished with 9 men, if not less (Carvalho should have seen red before for his tackle on Ronaldo, and when Makélélé was on a yellow card he elbowed Hargreaves in the face just three feet from the assistant...). Secondly, such contrast in styles in the last penalty takers. On one hand Ryan Giggs who has played all his life for Manchester United, who had won one Champions League after years and years of dedication, hard work and becoming an essential part of the team that won, on the other hand Nicolas Anelka, the most expensive player ever in cumulated fees, with already 8 transfers and 8 clubs in his wake, a serious attitude problem, and a Champions League won extremely early in his career, as a relatively fringe player who would leave the club the following season.

I totally agree, if shevchenko played in the game he would have scored and chelsea would have won. Grant is the biggest idiot for leaving Shevchenko on the bench. Biggest choaching blunder ever in champions league history.

Sheps - Chelsea had 24 attempts on goal to United's 15. They took a while to get going, United were the much better side up to Lampard's goal I think. But Chelsea really dominated in the second half onwards I think. United had good chances, but Chelsea just seemed to create so much.

Both sides were incredibly well matched all the way through the season, and I think they served up some good entertainment this evening, I enjoyed it. Whoever lost on Pens was going to feel a bit unlucky.

The haters? I think United deserved it over the course of the season, just Chelsea were better on the night is all.

Rob, are you kidding?! United should have sealed it within 40 minutes. From their equaliser onwards, Chelsea had chances too but so did United in extra time. It was a dead 50:50 game, I feel for JT as a United fan.

No-one can complain about the result. As I say, even on the night but so was last year's FA Cup final, and United dominated the FA Cup final 3 years ago and lost on pens.

United have shown that a club built around history and an amazing manager make the difference. Those are the reasons why players come to United, not to win the CL (coughBallackcough).

One final thought. Screw you kenyon.

The haters are all out today..

Is there a chance we could get side by side pics of Ronaldo, post penalty poo-poos? (v.Barcelona/v.Chelsea) I think it would make a nice wallpaper for my laptop at work.

When Anelka stepped up i was like "why is he number 7?" but it was a fucking awful pen. Bet Grant wishes he'd used Sheva instead now.

Unlucky Chelsea, deserved it on the night.