In Defence of the Defensive Approach

"I’m sorry but that is ridiculous, that is one guy’s opinion."

Which is the point I was making, of course.

"I think that the reason for your tirade..."

Can a person have a 2 sentence tirade?

"...a pre-existing prejudice towards the English and not because of comments about this game. I don’t want to use the ‘r’ word here but you are pushing it."

Go ahead. Use it. You would be wrong, of course, since an Englishman and I are most likely the same "'r' word" so that would make your little hissy fit wrong on several levels instead of just one.

The bottom line is that I find this whole thing amusing. I would call it hypocrasy, but that would imply that there was some integrity to become corrupted.

Tams, John: I applaud both of you. Despite this being a fairly heated topic of discussion, the two have you have made excellent points in a civil manner, and arrived at a better understanding of each others opinions. Huzzah.

I still think Chelsea are bitch-ass punks though. (Just kidding.)

John;

You bring up some very valid points. Like I said I am not a Barca fan so trust me i am not trying to make any excuses for them, just wanted to make sure you see the game in the context that it was played because in a game of inches its these types of things that really count.

I think for Barca the league is the most important thing to win. They have not won it in 2 years now and they want it more than anything. My brother is a Barca fan and he would def rather win the league. I dont think they would risk resting players in the league to try and push for the CL with us breathing down their necks (only 4 points now). For them, this is a new coach and a new team, a whole new cycle, so to even contemplate winning the treble is quite an achievement. My brother was expecting a transition year where they maybe won a trophy, he could never have imagined this. The way they see it, they have more than enough time to win the CL in the next few years.

Your point about rotations is extremely valid. The problem is that while Barca's first 11 is probably the best in the world, their bench is a few notches below. Hleb has failed to perform, Keita is just starting to find his feet now, Bojan and Busquets are basically both just kids and Gudjohnson is not consistent enough. I think come the summer you will see a few key changes. I think Hleb, Gudjohnson and Sylvinho will prob go and you will see players like Ribery, Hernanes and Zhirkov come in. Obviously not necessarily those three but players of the same caliber (those are the 3 my brother want). I think they definitely plan to bolster because they are lacking some quality in depth. Certainly they dont have the depth that Chelsea or Man UTd have which is probably why they are struggling a bit right now.

Of course this is all great news for me because we are going to play a tired Barca on Sat and then Villareal are going to play and even more tired Barca the week after :)

I admit it would be a shame if they didnt win anything this year, they have definitely been the best team in Europe. When they are on, when all their players are fresh, they are pretty much unstoppable. Say what you will about Spanish football, but I have seen them rip top quality teams to shreds like it was a training match.

@Tams
I didn't realize Barcelona's recent run was so top heavy! I suppose I meant that Chelsea had been playing meaningful games for just as long as Barca but it is true their recent matches haven't been quite as difficult. That's something I wish I had known before the game, I would have been watching for different things. In that context those headlines you mention seem ridiculous - I certainly didn't agree with them anyways.

This may be a little off-subject but you mentioned the team is tired: @Valencia last week, Messi, Iniesta, and Eto'o all played the full 90. Xavi played ~75. I realize every game is important in the title race but Barca did have a six point lead with six games remaining before the game started. Couldn't Bojan and Hleb have started? Throw Gudjohnsen in there too - sure it's a gamble but what is more important, trying to ensure a small lead in the title race or being rested before a grueling three-important-games-in-eight-days marathon?

Not to say English teams do everything right (hardly!) but Man U last year rested many players before key Champions League games and ended up dropping some points in the League in the process. This of course made the title race come down to the wire but it was a calculated risk. I personally think Barca could have done a bit more of that in recent weeks (ie at Getafe and hosting Recreativo) instead of playing the A-listers all game (though glancing at the lineups against Recreativo does show some rotation). Ultimately the fact that Barca is tired is their own fault, whether it is from overplaying the starters recently or not having quality depth in the squad - even of course by simply being alive in the late stages of all their major competitions. It's a problem all the top teams have to deal with, which you did acknowledge. I'm just saying that saying Barcelona was "off form" or "tired" as an excuse for not being able to score is just the same as saying "they didn't have enough good players" or "our home pitch was bad" - it's a problem of Barca's own making. I think that goes along with what I said about Barca's limited attacking options being their own fault.

That said, it is hardly a Glorious Accomplishment for Our Great Nation that many English papers are making it to be, you are totally right about that.

Its not Chelsea's tactics that make me angry, far from it, Chelsea have a right to play anyway they like. Call it cowardly, smart or just prudent, they will do whatever they can to try and win. Nothing wrong with that. What is wrong is the English press trying to make out that playing like this and getting a 0-0 is some great achievement. It isnt. In fact a 1-1 draw would have been much much better for Chelsea. Now they dont have any away goals. If anything this result slightly favours Barca who now only have to score and that is what they are good at.They dont even have to worry so much about conceding because as long as they keep scoring any score draw takes them through....they dont have to win, but Chelsea do.

@John

Of course you have to attribute something to the way Chelsea defended and I do. It definitely played its part and it made it much harder for Barca. When you have a line of players blocking the goal its hard enough but when those players are Terry, Lampard, Essien, Ballack, Alex, et al. well it is close to impossible wouldnt you say? However I would still attribute their lack of real penetration to their lack of sharpness. Take Messi for example, you asked why he didnt just keep running at Bosingwa, well probably because he has played in pretty much every single game in the last 8 weeks, and that includes a midweek game practically every week plus running off to south america to play another two games in a week for argentina. Its a bit much i think for any player, especially when you consider what a hard working, high octane player Messi is. Eto'o is exactly the same, except he is 28 so it must be even harder on him. It is no coincidence that Henry and Iniesta looked the freshest since they have gotten the most rest the last few weeks.

Sorry but you cannot compare the games Barca has with those Chelsea have. Their run in is completely different. Let me put it into perspective for u, if chelsea were in the same position as Barca they would have this run of games; Liverpool (H), Arsenal(A), Barcelona (H), Man Utd (A), Barcelona (A), Aston Villa (H). That is the kind of schedule Barcelona have to deal with all squeezed into barely three weeks. This is made even more difficult when you consider that compared to chelsea who have 26 outfield players to count on Barca only have 20. So depth is an issue for Barca as well and I think they will need to strengthen their squad a bit next year.

Regarding the money issue I wasnt comparing Chelsea's worth to Barcelona's, they are both immensely rich clubs. I was trying to put into perspective what Chelsea had achieved. I am comparing Chelsea's £200million squad to that of Hull or Stoke or Espanyol in Spain who successfully use the same tactic Chelsea used against top teams. Espanyol beat Barca at home this season using very much the same tactic. They got lucky in the end because Barca got a red card and VV gifted Espanyol a goal but still you can see my point. If Espanyol can beat them, and they are not a rich club by any means, why does Chelsea's 0-0 draw come off as such an accomplishment. I have read stories in the british papers with the headline; "Heroic Chelsea outclass Barca"..... REALLY!?!?!?!? I mean if Chelsea walked away from the Nou Camp 2-0 winners then i can understand headlines like this, but under these circumstances it just seems silly.

"Really? According to this guy (and a whole host of media outlets) you *do* all feel the same way - or at think that we nonanglos think this way, which makes the English more presumptuous in my book…"

I'm sorry but that is ridiculous, that is one guy's opinion. You are completely ignoring the fact that I feel the differently, and I know I'm not the only one. This guy claims he is speaking for "all football fans", not just English ones. And he is wrong. There is a difference between one person having an opinion and an entire nation having an opinion. I think that the reason for your tirade is a pre-existing prejudice towards the English and not because of comments about this game. I don't want to use the 'r' word here but you are pushing it.

I don't have any affiliation with either of these clubs but I do love football and regard the Champions League as cream of the crop when it comes to top flight European clubs.

Chelsea is supposed to be and considers themselves one of England's elite squads (if not arguably the best [although that's a bit much]) and yet they go into a match with those tactics and perform like that. To me it's a disgrace considering the amount of talent they have in that squad. From Drogba to Essien to Lampard they're loaded with skilled players but a performance like the one we just saw is an absolute disgrace.

I really hope Barça gets that away goal and defeats Chelski at the bridge as I'd really like to see a United-Barça final seeing as they're truly the two best teams in this competition. I really hope I don't have to watch another United-Chelski final.

Well Tams I suppose if you watch all of Barca's games then you know them better than I do. I don't get to watch too many games live anyways so I usually just see the highlights. From what I recall of the highlights it is usually Messi / Henry / Iniesta shredding the defense with good passing & movement and getting in one on one with the keeper.

I will say you may be right about Barca being off but I will still argue that Chelsea had something to do with that too. Until this last week Chelsea still had some chance at the title so they're getting tired too. Also if Chelsea is worth 200 mil how much is Barca worth? If you are referring to the club's worth (I'm not sure if you meant the players) then according to Forbes Barcelona is actually worth a little more. But I will grant it is easier to defend at any rate.

I don't understand why Messi didn't keep running at Boswinga. Maybe that could be explained by your "they were off form" theory - Boswinga already had a yellow and clearly had to be careful.

"And please stop making this about the English, you’re being presumptuous if you think we all feel the same way."

Really? According to this guy (and a whole host of media outlets) you *do* all feel the same way - or at think that we nonanglos think this way, which makes the English more presumptuous in my book...

"Elliot | April 30th, 2009 at 11:10 am

Barca is toast. Chelsea went to Spain and gave them the what for, and I as well as the majority of football fans are very happy about that. What’s pathetic is the Barca players and fans response to being Shut Down………Messi and Henry who?

All that’s left now is the death blow which will be delivered on home soil.

Well Done Cheslea, well done indeed…..God Save The Queen."

And please stop making this about the English, you're being presumptuous if you think we all feel the same way. I personally was both bored and annoyed with Chelsea's tactics.

You shouldn't listen to anything the commentators say they're clearly complete idiots, especially ITV commentators.

Also I would like to make it clear that i dont advocate complaining about Chelsea's tactics. Chelsea did what they had to do against a team that is superior to them. They played the way all inferior teams play in order to survive. It is perfectly understandable the same way Hull going to Old Trafford and parking the bus is perfectly understandable.

What I cannot stand is ppl acting like it is some great success to walk away with a 0-0 draw under these circumstances. I live in the UK so I watch these games on SKY/ITV and some the pundits and commentating is quite ridiculous at times. They make out like Chelsea outplayed Barca by parking the bus. The same commentators btw who will lambaste the Italian teams for doing exactly the same thing against the English. It is infuriating at times, especially when so many ppl buy into it. Can ppl really be so ignorant and short sighted?

lol.....ah John I take it you have not seen Barca play much this season because they were quite off their usual game against Chelsea. This is probably due to the fact that the scheduling in Spain this year has been a bit ludicrous and Barca have had to play the top four teams in Spain along with Chelsea twice in less than 3 weeks. Chelsea can rest most of their players in the league since they are comfortably in third and realistically are not going to move. Barca on the other hand have got us (Madrid) breathing down their necks so they cannot afford to rest any players. Are they going to be any fresher next week against Chelsea...I doubt it....if anything they are going to be more tired because they have to play us on Saturday and we are very fresh, having not played any midweek games in a while now. So what you have seen is a fresh Chelsea play a tired Barca, park the bus and barely hold them to a 0-0 draw. Very impressive i must say.

Chelsea are a team worth what? Well over £200 million? So when they "park the bus" its going to be practically impossible to get through. Sorry but if teams that are worth £20million can use this tactic to successfully stop big teams in the EPL and in Spain is it really a surprise that a team full of world class players can do the same? In fact if they were so good then Barca shouldnt have had a sniff at goal, but they did. 6 shots on target when the opposing team have basically built a wall around their goal is pretty good. Especially when you consider that "everybody" includes some of the best defenders in the world and some of the best defensive/physical mid fielders in the world. If anything Chelsea should be disappointed because only luck allowed them to walk away with a draw. Luck has also handed them a great advantage in that now they get to play Barca at home minus Puyol and Marquez.

As for your free kicks/corners argument, well i cant really argue there. Its something i have heard many Barca fans complain about and i am sure it is something they will try and rectify next season.

Will Chelsea win the 2nd leg, probably, but to try and make out like Chelsea did a number on Barca is just silly. They used a tactic used by many teams when facing superior opposition, a tactic that works. How many times have we seen Hull or Stoke park the bus at Anfield, Old trafford or Stamford Bridge and frustrate their opponents. Its hardly rocket science and with such a experienced, world class Chelsea side I am quite shocked that ppl are really so naive that they think holding Barca to a draw using this tactic is some magnificent feat. Please. You English really need to get over yourselves...

From a fan with no vested interest in either side's success (nor a bias towards the EPL, Liga, Spanish, British, whomever), here's my take.

First, I'll note the "problem" in quotations because I believe the only "problem" it presents is to the viewers: a degradation of the beautiful game. It's a perfectly fair and sometimes brilliant tactic that sadly does not yield the kind of football that the viewers prefer. However if it's your team on the receiving end of the offensive barrage, you usually end up applauding their efforts in achieving the draw. And when your club is the one creating chances, you cry "poor football".

I think a raw solution to this "problem" has already been mentioned by Alessio. However his suggestion is a compromise. Few besides the television audience benefit from a single game on a neutral site. One match means less TV time which means less ad revenue. A neutral site means many of the fans don't get to attend the game.

I would be in favor of a seeding system with home field advantage onward from the group stage. This would equal one less game per pairing, but the fans of the "more deserving team" would still get to witness their club play.

Probably not going to happen though because it always comes down to one thing. $.

Tams if I end up being wrong I will eat my words. If it was in fact that Barca were "tired and jaded" then perhaps they will score three or four in London. I don't think anything I said was wrong about their one-dimensionality. Now obviously that one dimension is good, probably the best in the world, but still for having 70% of possession to only put 6 chances on target is pretty weak. Cech played okay but I didn't think it was exactly "great goalkeeping" as he got lucky a couple times.

I guess I just give credit to Chelsea for forcing Barca to look "not their best" rather than using Barca's appearance as an excuse for not scoring. Chelsea DID shut them down, probably had a little luck but I would also say Chelsea had the best scoring chance of the game and Barca were lucky not to concede an away goal.

Sure when you give another team 70% possession they will open you up a few times. But there were VERY few times when the opening up actually unnerved the back line completely. Chelsea could play a little more conservative (giving free kicks and corners) because Barca had no one to punish them for it. I don't see how the return leg will be any different unless Bojan remembers how to head the ball.

"Barca is supposedly such a dangerous team because they have so many attacking options, but almost all of their attacking options are actually the same. Quick forwards with good ball control, clever passing but little aerial threat or long range ability. Eto’o probably can head them in occasionally but otherwise he is a carbon copy of Henry and Messi. If you don’t give them space they are useless, and maybe the only reason we all thought Barca was such a juggernaut was because they’ve hardly played anybody all year with the defensive discipline to not give up PKs or allow easy through balls for 90 minutes."

Sorry John but that is a pile of mess. The only reason Barca didnt win that game is because they didnt take their chances, which is a rarity. The truth is Chelsea got lucky. With all their physical superiority, with all their men behind the ball with all their defensive experience they still could not stop a Barca, that was playing nowhere near their best, from opening them up more than once. In fact Barca looked tired and jaded and I am happy to see they will come into el classico a bit off color. Its only a bit of luck and some great goalkeeping that kept Chelsea in it. Could have finished 3-0 so dont act like Chelsea came and completely shut Barca out cos that is nowhere near the truth and I am Madrid fan so trust me when i tell you i wont lose sleep over Barca getting knocked out.

Also it is faaar from over. Lets see what happens next week when Chelsea have to come out of their shells a bit.

I thought that Barca was so "good" that they could break through any parked bus. Then again, a parked bus as expensive as Chelsea can only be effective. And Barca definitely had their share of good opportunities during the match.

Troy - I'm not commenting as a member of Barca's squad; I'm not even a Barcelona fan. I typically characterize them as being whining, diving, ref backed Farce-a-lona. But regardless, I still tune in to Champions League matches hoping to see a competitive match, not an assault on the castle walls, where one team is content in merely hiding it's goal.

But I hope for the same as you: that Chelsea will attempt to actually win against Barcelona and will be found out accordingly. That Barcelona will now be without two of their best center backs changes the odds a bit, but that's the game. They still have a chance at winning, now that there's a chance Chelsea might try and play.

I'm a neutral in this but I have to say that the whining about defensive strategies by any team has to stop. I agree with nsd6 that the same strategy shouldn't be described as unfair by one group and smart by another - that said, I think in general that strategy is a smart one.

For all their goal scoring prowess, Barcelona are severely missing several offensive dimensions. They have no aerial threat, very little long range shooting threat, and very little free kick threat. Barca had a few great chances to score from free kicks (they're missing Ronaldinho now I bet) but kicked them straight into the wall or otherwise missed badly. Corner kicks were usually completely wasted with very little attempt to even win a header.

Barca is supposedly such a dangerous team because they have so many attacking options, but almost all of their attacking options are actually the same. Quick forwards with good ball control, clever passing but little aerial threat or long range ability. Eto'o probably can head them in occasionally but otherwise he is a carbon copy of Henry and Messi. If you don't give them space they are useless, and maybe the only reason we all thought Barca was such a juggernaut was because they've hardly played anybody all year with the defensive discipline to not give up PKs or allow easy through balls for 90 minutes.

@Elliot

What does the queen have to do with anything?? I assume its because your proud to be English and you think the EPL's dominance is a sign of English success? If that is the case then you are greatly deluded. For one the top four EPL teams are dominated by foreign players. If you took em all out then you would be left with 4 mediocre teams at best. The teams are not owned by the English or managed by the English. There is nothing English about them aside from their names. This is also exemplified in your national team who, despite always being hyped in the media, fail to perform every single time an international competition comes along. You didn't even qualify from an easy group for the last one. So you dont really have anything to be proud of. When a team that is actually made up of Enlgish players wins something then maybe you will have something to be proud of. Till then please stop embarrassing yourself.

it'd be nice if we didn't have to hear crying from barca's entire squad...grow up, get an away goal and get over it...no one wants to hear you bitch that your opponent did not stand around and let you do whatever you want...


the complaints from barca are a strong indication of the lack of defense in la liga...messi is great and dribbling past the entire team of racing santander, but where is that ability when he goes up against ferdinand, vidic, terry, etc.?

ronaldo does it week in, week out, against all comers...that is why he won the ballon d'or

Sure, it's effective. I just wish it wasn't so damn boring.

(C'mon, Barca away goal!!)

I think its hilarious that when Stoke City or Middlesborough try this against Man U or Chelsea all you ever hear is complaints from the managers about "parking the team bus in front of the goal"

When Chelsea or Man U do it to Barca, its "great tactics"

Teams do what they have to do to get a result, but its quite obvious that when you play like that you're acknowledging that your team is inferior. Chelsea might make it through, but the best team (by even Chelsea's admittance) will not have won.

Its kind of pathetic that Chelsea fans can be annoyed at the inferior BPL teams for "not playing football" but then praise themselves for "grinding out a result"

Isn't the Champion's League purported to be the highest platform of European club football? A stage where the best play off against the best? If so:

If a scoreless draw is considered a triumph, then your team shouldn't be in the CL semi-final to begin with.

I understand the mentality that the result is all that matters, I just think if you have a competitive team, you should play competitive football - not one dimensional defensive football with no real intent to score. If that's the only way a team can be competitive, then why should that team expect to be considered the best? Why should it even be in the running?

The fact that Manchester United did it and got away with it last season didn't make it any less boring, unattractive and at times painful to watch. Are those adjectives (boring, unnattractive, painful, etc.) the kind of adjectives associated with the CL? If so, take your trophies, they'll mean much less than they used to.

If this is what people want watch in the Champion's League, what is purported to be the highest platform of European club football, then I'll watch something else.

Barca is toast. Chelsea went to Spain and gave them the what for, and I as well as the majority of football fans are very happy about that. What’s pathetic is the Barca players and fans response to being Shut Down…......Messi and Henry who?

All that’s left now is the death blow which will be delivered on home soil.

Well Done Cheslea, well done indeed…..God Save The Queen.